At least bring common sense to the table
… the movie – 2004 – By Michael Moore
Published on May 4, 2011 By BoobzTwo In Politics

I must confess that I actually thought I hated this man and everything he was about until I started experiencing an overload of inaccurate and fictitious information the USG keeps pounding out and calling it the truth … so I decided to try an independent review of what I thought I knew and didn’t really. So I never watched or read anything Moore was involved with but I was more than willing to tell you how screwed up he was. So I rented the movie from Netflix and watched it … and I was amazed.

I have watched it twice now and I cannot find one shred of much information that is not factual or accurate. Beyond some idiosyncrasies in his sense of humor (they are funny); he presents very valid arguments and backs them up with documentation and interviews. He brings to light many of the things I have discovered in my own research into deceit, terrorism and the USG.

When I was a liberal (before I knew better) the only accurate information had to come from another liberal else it was a lie??? Later when I made my second mistake and became a conservative I learned the error of my ways … the truth could only be had from like ilk … so imagine my confusion when I called the neolibs and neocons for what they are and went independent. Suddenly, I have no source of valid information at all now (seemingly hehehe). I have had no success at all trying to walk the moderate tightrope between all the sharks without one side or the other dragging me down, go figure.

As far as Democrats/Republicans are concerned, their only care about the independent majority is how many they can acquire each election. But no matter which side is the best recruiter or who gets most independent votes … matters that concern the moderates will largely be ignored or sidelined and the neo-politicians will go their own course virtually unrestricted and completely unaccountable.


Comments (Page 14)
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on May 16, 2011

BoobzTwo
Rather than the apple of God's eye, the Carl Sagans of the world would have us believe the still unsupported assumption that the earth is an insignificant speck in the universe, just one of "billions and billions" of planets that could support life.

BoobzTwo
You cannot prove god has an eye to have an apple in

That is just a saying and one that I think carries a lot of weight. After all, the earth IS  the only planet where life is found.

BoobzTwo
Sagan can prove his points unperturbed by mysticism.

Well, Sagan can't prove anything since he died long ago. 

But the point is even though Sagan confidently predicted there must be billions and billions of planets out there teeming with life, he never proved any such thing. Just hasn't been done by him or anyone else in the scientific community and that's why I said "the still unsupported assumption". 

....................

lulapilgrim
What we do know from science is that the earth is truly unique in that it is the only one that supports life...plant, animal and human life. Earth is the only one that has conditions necessary to life and they persuavively argue the possibility that that has occurred in precise combination on other planets is infinitesimally small.

BoobzTwo
We do not know this stuff not in your context anyway.

Come on? I said we know from science...that's your context.

 

on May 16, 2011

lulapilgrim
I think science and the universe prove the existence of Almighty God. I arrived at my conclusion relative to science which cannot contradict the Holy Bible, specifically Genesis, which states that out of nothing, Almighty God created the physical Universe and all that's in it including space, time and matter as well as all the laws of nature that came into operation.


Ya, I know it concerns faith in the trustworthiness of God as a reliable eye-witness to Creation. Faith enables me to begin a particular hypothesis about ancient Origin events. Genesis informs us of the who and the why, but not the when and how of Creation.


I won't belabor this as BT has been patient about us getting off topic a bit

Ok Lula, now you have jumped completely back to theology, no, no, no. Back to 911 with you!

on May 16, 2011

BoobzTwo
I said ... "The answer would be no … proving infinity and proving gods existence fall into the same category, the paranormal where they belong. No Idea how you drew your conclusion? To infinity and beyond ... Lula, you are the one who brought the infinate universe into the discussion.

No, in fact it was Mystikmind in #178 where he/she mentioned the "infinite universe" twice.

I was merely responding to that.

.......................

BoobzTwo
The following reply seems to cover this also???
Quoting BoobzTwo,
reply 189
I am afraid it doesn't. Everyone I know of is in agreement that the universe is expanding and until it decides to stop, it is infinite. Besides the point is moot, humans will cease to exist as a species way before that happens. Also I might add, our contemporary and empirical capabilities limit our ability to inaccurately view the universe beyond 46 billion light years (diameter) so all we are presently dealing with is what we can see and it is called the known universe.

I know. I responded to your point when I cited that website and posted a few paragraphs from it. I thought that it answered alot of the points brought up in the discussion. Notice, if you will, at the very end...it mentions that the universe is expanding but that it is not infinite. Here it is:

lulapilgrim
An infinite universe for example would exist in every direction forever, there could be nothing else, ONLY the universe. It is then very easy to understand why our universe cannot be infinite, it is because it is expanding. It cannot be both infinite and expanding. It could be infinite OR expanding, but CANNOT possibly be both, that is a contradiction in terms, and we do know it is expanding.

BoobzTwo
My ‘book’ defines the universe as the totality of all matter and energy that exists in the vastness of space, whether known to human beings or not. If you want to play with infinity here, be my guest. Seemingly math is not high on your study list or the concept of infinity would be well known to you.

Your definition of universe is fine.

As far as "infinity" and understanding it in terms of mathematics, again, I refer to the website. It did a good job and even though I'm not a scientific type or strong in math, it makes sense to me.

 

 

 

on May 16, 2011

Lula posts:

BoobzTwo
I won't belabor this as BT has been patient about us getting off topic a bit

BoobzTwo
Ok Lula, now you have jumped completely back to theology, no, no, no. Back to 911 with you!

Okay. Deal.

on May 16, 2011

Lula, this picking out little tidbits is pointless … just say what you mean to. Please try to apply some common sense and stop looking at everything as an attack. Everyone knows the saying … just my way of telling you that you cannot prove gods existence. You seem to think you are knowledgeable on Sagan … I don’t think so. This is not accurate at all, “Sagan confidently predicted there must be billions and billions of planets out there teeming with life” because he said no such thing. You might have found something more useful considering he published more than 600 scientific papers and such and was author or editor of more than 20 books among many other accomplishments. Amazing that ‘my stuff’ is always unsupported assumptions … and your stuff is well, gospel. I think you can use the word science in a sentence Lula, but know little about the processes employed in search of actual for real knowledge … or what that even is for that matter, go figure. Everything in the universe is unique and due to the limits of our technical prowess, we have only found life on earth probably because we cannot go anywhere else, yet, to check it out up close and personal … just like we have to do here, go figure. You do not understand the numbers. At the speed of light, it will take 100,000 years just to cross our galaxy and the closest galaxy would take 2,000,000 years to get there … so don’t expect much empirical data for a while. We have to discover a different way or technology or we are on a slow learning curve for sure. We aren’t even close to light speed … yet.

Oops ... didn't see your post in time,sorry.

on May 17, 2011

lulapilgrim
Genesis informs us of the who and the why, but not the when and how of Creation.

Nitpick- Genesis does give the "how"; i.e. God did it. And in the case of the Bible, that is indeed a legimitate explanation.

BoobzTwo
At the speed of light, it will take 100,000 years just to cross our galaxy and the closest galaxy would take 2,000,000 years to get there … so don’t expect much empirical data for a while. We have to discover a different way or technology or we are on a slow learning curve for sure. We aren’t even close to light speed … yet.

Nitpick: we will never be capable of traveling at c. This, however, does not exclude traveling at near-c, or >c velocities.

As such, crossing the galaxy (straightline, edge-to-edge), would take 101,010.101 years at a velocity of 0.99c. Sadly, traveling at near-c velocities (as in above 0.5c) is excessively difficult, as it is mass-prohibitive to carry the reaction mass and fuel necessary to accelerate up to, and decelerate down from (you did plan on stopping at the end, didn't you?) such velocities.

Fun fact: even though from the perspective of Earth, a transgalactic edge-to-edge journey would take ~101,010 years, only ~14,226.8 years will pass for the intrepid humans aboard the ship.

on May 17, 2011

Worst forum eva for staying ON TOPIC. 

on May 17, 2011

This thread has a topic?  

on May 17, 2011

myfist0
Worst forum eva for staying ON TOPIC.

This thread was posted in a subforum that is part of the OFF-TOPIC forum. Herp-derp, it's supposed to be off-topic.

ElanaAhova
This thread has a topic?

Exactly.

on May 17, 2011

Previously when i refereed to the universe being 'infinite' i was talking about open space, not matter. Since i am coming from my original idea on the location within infinity paradox. Location specifically refers to matter, any matter, planets, galaxies, whatever, because any matter that exists, has to have a location, a location within infinity, which is impossible!

on May 17, 2011

myfist0
Worst forum eva for staying ON TOPIC.
It has been my unfortunate displeasure to experience this on just about all my articles. I have always tried to answer posts made on my OP's as long as there was some indication of actual intelligence there. I do not understand why they don't write their own off topic posts but most seem to think differently, go figure.

For your consideration - I cannot understand why people are so reluctant to rethink their position based on evidence that of necessity had to take years to accumulate? Anyway, I didn’t remember that SEC had stored ~3500 files related to Wall Street fraud investigations in Wt-7. Who knows what documentation the IRS and CIA etcetera needed to lose? When I first saw the towers fall, I knew there was something wrong. I thought this was interesting.


Galileo’s Law of falling bodies     Distance Ft = 16.08 Ft *sec2   
     Free fall   =   1362 Ft/16.08 Ft=84.7 sec2 = 9.2 seconds.  
                                  Actual fall time             10.1 seconds.


There are many good references in this YouTube …
911 Loose Change (full-length)    http://youtu.be/7E3oIbO0AWE     Rating – Good = 24,247 (87%) Bad = 3709 (13%)

on May 17, 2011

Mystikmind
Reply #205
Mystikmind
OH well ... You have a strange way of viewing infinity? Let the idiots fight that one out because there is no answer right now. Everything in the universe has a specific location relative to everything else. And there is nothing odd about Earthlings making the Earth the center of things ... because it is for us … it is just the only view we have is all. But the reality is … Earth is a grain of sand in the bigger scheme of the Universe. You don’t have to understand the infinity part, common sense will do.

on May 17, 2011

Ive only read the last few post.  The universe is finite, it is expanding, and it's also mostly flat.  Open space beyond matter and energy of our universe is not infinity, its nothing.  Nothing and infinity are not the same thing. 

on May 17, 2011

Whiskey144
This thread was posted in a subforum that is part of the OFF-TOPIC forum. Herp-derp, it's supposed to be off-topic.
Am I just doomed to suffer this nonsense??? I posted this under "movies and TV" well because it was a movie, of all things. You are a big part of that nonsense herein and you know it, shame on you. Off topic does not mean you may do whatever you want to disrupt things because … that is called hijacking. Off topic refers to the topic matter, silly boy. And the topic matter herein is 9/11.

on May 17, 2011

Lord Xia
Ive only read the last few post. The universe is finite, it is expanding, and it's also mostly flat. Open space beyond matter and energy of our universe is not infinity, its nothing. Nothing and infinity are not the same thing.
Nice try there. You may postulate the nether reigns as I am sure there are many equations to help there. We can prove nothing beyond our technical and intellectual abilities. At present, this is not within our power. Now as hard as it is to discuss infinity and beyond … I pity you if you try to describe nothing here on JU … good luck there.

PS - I know this is strange but we are actually discussing 9/11. I know ... couldn't prove it much from the posts, sorry (NMF).

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