At least bring common sense to the table
Opinion of a non believer
Published on November 5, 2011 By BoobzTwo In Religion

Actual History is chockfull of the rise and fall of religions for millennia … many Ages. And they all have the following in common. Whenever they became week enough to lose control of the majority of the sheeple, they are replaced with a new Messiah and a new message just as the Christians have done with the ‘old Jewish’ religion when that too lost its strangle hold on the world of Man due to its barbarism as perceived by man in a new Age. Anyone who lives in a future time views almost everything from previous times to be barbaric (except for those that thrive in barbarism) and in this Christianity is no exception. It is my belief that the purpose of religion has always been nothing but a methodology to control the masses. The Bible (OT and NT) are replete with plagiarisms from the actual real world of the past. The NT is in itself a plagiarism from much of the OT. The stories of the Bible are impossible in the real world in which we all exist. I agree that many names and places were real, but this is just another plagiarism from the actual history of man. If you can place your hand on a Bible and swear that the Earth is what ~12,000 years old, then you are a fool. If you deny the evidence of science and technology, then you are doubly a fool. If you deny the evidence of early man or prehistoric man and can find no logic or truth in evolution you are a damned fool. And if you are so foolish as to allow the leadership of some rascals who lived thousands of years ago during the ‘glorious’ days when all this stuff was concocted … to control virtually every aspect of your life today, you are doomed. But all you have to do is ‘have faith’ and ignore your own perceptions of reality … and all will be yours, just bring your pocket book and come often … because we have castles and churches and armies to build to prove they are right, yea right. The all-powerful all-knowing one God would never vanquish the devil (certainly within reason for the all-powerful mindful of His sheep) because He would be destroying Himself … as there can be no light without the dark? What better ploy could man devise than to make the light and the dark impervious to the perceptions of man, the sheeple? The complete history of the universe and that insignificant little planet Earth with its complete compliment of well ‘everything’ … all described between the covers of a book written thousands of years ago by smart (-ass) people with nothing benign in mind whatsoever who championed a flat Earth for a thousand years for naught than to promote the new religion of the Age of Pisces … the two fish. It took man and a simple invention called a telescope to start the downward spiral of Religion (Christianity this time) and it cannot be stopped.


Comments (Page 7)
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on Dec 03, 2012

lulapilgrim
Reply #88 lulapilgrim
Do you (somehow) feel yourself proficient with the ‘scientific process’ to such degree (cross-disciplines mind you) that YOU can pick and choose what science are to be believe or not? Just out of curiosity, which of the sciences do you think are good … bet you cannot name one? What Catholic literature can you produce that says which sciences are good or bad … ANY at all … and if you cannot …? Or are you telling me that anything that YOU think disagrees with the bible must be false and therefore YOU don’t have to prove anything … as always? As I said before I am not going to play with the RCC (your job) and you are not going to get away hiding behind your RCC-C which has nothing to do with what was written in the bible. What prey tell do the Constitution and DOI espouse that is so religiously profound or as you said “…to the point of being some of their most crucial expressions.”? Inquiring minds want to know? At least you agree that the bible is not science but any book with the audacity to claim to make the world from nothing and populate it with both flora and fauna is infringing on reality not the other way around. Reality such as it is, is the only one we have so any variances from the reality are the exceptions to that reality. If you insist on bringing magic into everything we discuss, well there won’t be much for me to participate in will there. We could discuss cool things like ice core samples that range back to some 400,000 years ago (no magic required). We could discuss how a stand of trees can be 80,000 years old or a Pine called Prometheus which was measured by ring count at 4,862 years old when it was felled in 1964 (no science required). How about the immortal jellyfish, it is known to be the longest living creature which could live on forever (because of evolution) without dying of old age (but can be killed). But your only goal is to make the earth less than 6,000 years old and that takes all the fun out of it for me. Evolutionary theory doesn’t and cannot be applied to genesis so we will have to discuss them separately. Besides as you said man wasn’t there when the world was created (something else we can agree on) so how do you know then (your favorite attack on evolution) sooo right back at you? You are clueless as to what a scientific theory means because I have explained it several times … so what is it supposed to grow into then, evolutionary Law? Simply stated we are discovering new species still today but they had to come from somewhere didn’t they, unless you think they are just poofing into existence now.  It is evolutionary  theory because we don’t have it all worked out yet (so many gaps and variables to consider) and we never will, that is just the beauty of science, they don’t give up … they just keep on looking for more or for something else. And disregarding the lineages of a few people written in a first century book, how do you scientifically calculate the age of the earth then? What are they supposed to teach in school considering that both Creationism and its modern clone ID are proved to be nothing but religious dogma and they are not allowed to be taught in public schools? If so ordered, I am sure they would find some way to include it in the curriculum, but until that time you don’t have a leg to stand on with this excuse. Evolutionists (what silly circles you create) don’t make up names; there is no Department of Evolution. Names are made by the paleontologists, geologists, chemists, biologists, geneticists, physicists, astronomers and astrophysicists etc. who discovered(s) them.  The first large scale fauna catalog, Aristotle's History of Animals was published around 343 BC so even evolutionary principles had been in play for 2,000 years before we received Darwin’s ‘gift from the devil’ but the church wasn’t having any of that competitive nonsense then or now.

“The way evolutionists date things is like a dog chasing its tail. I offer the work of two scientists. Guy Berthault, a member of the French Academy of Sciences who around 1988 proved beyond little doubt that Charles Lyell's theory of the geologic column (i.e. that layers of sediment were formed over millions of years) is false. Geological Society of France, 1993, and Julien Lan and Guy Berthault, "Experiments of Stratification of heterogeneous sand mistures, " CEN Technical Journal 8 (1):3750, 1994; Guy Berthault, "Experiments on laminations of sediments," CEN Technical Journal 3:2529, 1988”.

Not my field of likes so I will have to research these claims and get back to you. I hope that isn’t going to be a waste of time again though.

on Dec 03, 2012

lulapilgrim
As far as the Stellar and Darwin Evolution list and all those millions of years, the onus of proof is upon the evolutionists to prove their case.
First off there is no obligation on my part to prove anything to anyone because that is not my job. This is the real world in which real things happen for reasons we understand and magic is being used as a distraction against progress. I am not trying to become a Catholic or a Christian god forbid and the reasons are quite simple. The bible is a magical rendition of man’s own barbaric first century worldview and demands senseless cruelty, unquestionable subjugation, abject slavery, that nothing may be questioned, no education allowed and no personal moral responsibility permitted. Lula I have several complete multi-volume encyclopedias that support science and evolution of the species and you have a first century opinion. What prey tell could ever be presented to you as proof if these volumes are insufficient because as you say … they are all works of fiction made from lies and guesses and are not supported with any empirical evidence or proof because the scientists don’t know what real science is (geese) and all of this nonsense for the sole purpose of destroying Christianity? One of us needs a reality check.

The chart is only a chart and it just shows key points of interest and emphasizes the time scales involved and that mucho time that is required. The only ones looking for some 'missing links' are the same people who cannot conceptualize evolutionary theory ... else they wouldn't be looking for them either because all the poofing in this discussion comes from you not me. Anyway evolution predicts nothing of the sort but it is another something Creationists try to make sound credible. Australopithecus Afarensis  (Lucy for example -3,200,000 ya) comes with stunning details but why would you want to go back four million years knowing that the further back we go the less records we have. Normally if one is interested in puzzling out the past they start with the most current data and thus the most accurate data and work backwards. I would suggest we start here with modern man if you really want to discuss this: Humans (Homo sapiens) are primates of the family Hominidae, and the only living species of the genus Homo. All the other Homo’s have gone extinct because they were left behind by evolution. That is why we still have the Great apes and people today and why they are only slightly different. We originated in Africa around 4 mya, reached anatomical modernity about 200,000 ya, began to exhibit full behavioral modernity around 50,000 ya and became modern humanity around 35.000 ya, almost 30,000 years before your world was created. Everything considered ‘ape like’ back then lived in caves or trees or it didn’t live long enough to pass on its genes. The Homo-line was in charge of nothing in nature until they learned enough to control their immediate environment … until they became human. If you want to discuss Adam and Eve (genesis) then you need to explain how pedigree collapse resulting from the gene pool of one was avoided. In the case of Noah, they had three fertile couples with one male line which doesn’t offer any appreciable relief from continued pedigree collapse considering that the previous population was at its peak gene pool (and moral) collapse and disliked by your creator so much that he destroyed all the rest so he could play god and do it all over again and who would have guessed it would turn out the same. Seems like your god should have known how it turns out BOTH times, hummm.

 

on Dec 03, 2012

lulapilgrim
I offer the work of two scientists. Guy Berthault, a member of the French Academy of Sciences who around 1988 proved beyond little doubt that Charles Lyell's theory of the geologic column (i.e. that layers of sediment were formed over millions of years) is false. Geological Society of France, 1993, and Julien Lan and Guy Berthault, "Experiments of Stratification of heterogeneous sand mistures, " CEN Technical Journal 8 (1):3750, 1994; Guy Berthault, "Experiments on laminations of sediments," CEN Technical Journal 3:2529, 1988.
French young Earth creationist Guy Berthault claims to have discovered sedimentation properties that dispute several stratigraphic and relative dating principles used by modern field geologists through numerous laboratory studies. Berthault's knowledge of the sedimentology literature and stratigraphic field methods are decades or even centuries out of date (just as with Wells). Because of his lack of knowledge (honesty), Berthault's experiments often involved "reinventing the wheel". When compared with Berthault, YEC Steve Austin (1994, chapter 2 only) has a better understanding of these fundamental principles. And now knowing that Julien Y. Lan is also a YEC and close friend of YEC Guy Berthault; so what would you expect them to say when they profess up front that GOD is the ultimate authority on everything, give this nonsense a brake please. Besides as usual, you are after Darwin and now his friends like Charles Lyell who was born in 1791 for goodness sake. Berthault's "Stratigraphy" was simply his rediscovering what geologists already knew and have moved beyond. This is not an appealing subject for me, are you sure you want to go here?

I should have known better …

on Dec 04, 2012

 

lulapilgrim
The way evolutionists date things is like a dog chasing its tail.
I offer the work of two scientists. Guy Berthault, a member of the French Academy of Sciences who around 1988 proved beyond little doubt that Charles Lyell's theory of the geologic column (i.e. that layers of sediment were formed over millions of years) is false.

GirlFriendTess
Berthault's "Stratigraphy" was simply his rediscovering what geologists already knew and have moved beyond. This is not an appealing subject for me, are you sure you want to go here?

 

Exactly. The scientists pushing Darwin Evolution  knew/know that their "Geologic Column" also called "Geologic History of the Earth" has been proven false beyond a shadow of doubt. But here's the sorrowful kicker...instead of doing the right thing and rejecting Darwin's Theory of Evolution, the evolutionists continue to show the geologic column and claim their dates of millions of years as scientific fact in every science textbook out there, as well as in documentaries, video and public broadcasts.

The "Geologic Column" with its "Era", "Period" "Epoch" dates in the millions of years are proven false.  

The actual laying down of the fossil strata proves evolutionary science that is made to bend to Darwin Evolution is all false...that's why I call it pseudo science.

Back in 1800s of Darwin and Lyell's day, Geology and Paleontology held great expectations hoping to find actual evidence of Darwin's theory of Evolution. But now after over 120 years of the most extensive exploration of every continent and ocean bottom, the picture is complete because fossils do not reveal any evidence of a gradual and continual evolution of life from a common ancestor.

Instead of lying and masquerading Darwin's Theory as scientific fact, they should be shouting from the rooftops, Darwin Evolution has not occurred, is not occurring, and will never occur.

 

 

on Dec 04, 2012

Lula don’t you ever just want to discuss something, it would be nice? The only reason you are compelled to look at everything as an attack on Christianity is because everything you cannot reconcile into your mystical world you self-define it as an attack to the very last person and word. This is just all screwed up and reason is all you need to see it. First of all the world exists and always has as far as mankind is concerned and that makes everything we find in it REAL. We have real science that deals with real evidence because we are not privy to magic so it never enters the equations.  Simply, science only deals with reality for the sole purpose of becoming more knowledgeable about ‘nature’. No arguments are ever made against magic because it is not involved in this process. Magic cannot be measured, monitored, detected or quantified therefore it is magic or it is not. If anything is responsible for this conundrum it is your idol whose absolute privacy from exposure from ALL its would-be-subjects could only be self-arranged as it planted the evidence for an aged universe. You have your book which ignores everything in reality excusing ALL science as inconsequential (without any proof for that choice) besides an archaic (non-scientific) book that doesn’t do anything besides defend itself … just like every book written ... told you so. Surely you can grasp the concept that everything was not included in your bible. But pray tell what possible incentive could there have been to include ANYTHING remotely controversial (in their 1st century minds anyway) after hundreds of years of weeding through it? Nevertheless we ‘free thinkers’ have science (and quite a few Christians do too) who educate themselves in the actual workings of our universe; not devote their lives to the destruction of the very concept. We are quite inquisitive and constructive by nature and are amassing an actual REAL history based on science and math and needless to say without any magic. As far as I am concerned, until such time as you folk can prove something magical, you are the world’s would-be-usurpers and would force your mysticism on everyone else destroying their gods (or none) and their free will in the process. We are aggressing nothing here nor are we trying to destroy pipe dreams … just moving forward working under the limitations we must comply with. Lula it doesn’t matter how strongly you feel about your religion, you cannot force it on others without a sword and you are being ultra-naïve just to think you can without one lick of proof. Your complete world is controlled by your clergy and you are forbidden to question or challenge ANY OF IT. I am under no such constraints and am free to discover life as I choose and I for one will never capitulate to any person or organization that would force me to see life through a barbaric 1st century worldview. Just my opinions so don’t get your panties in a knot. The problem with Christianity (as a story) is that most Christians are so unlike their chosen idol in most respects besides the idol worship parts anyway. If you choose to live your life as if you were born in sin so grave that you must make penance (TO THE CHURCH oh in the name of GOD who doesn’t need it) for the rest of your ever so real life even considering you had nothing to do with anything, that is your choice. I am as free and as compassionate as I can be and I am not burdened by anything besides reality (more than enough of a problem). If you take the magic out of the bible you have no theology (just a more pointless book). That means that it is just the magic you covet so you can pretend to defy reality. Theology is just the support system conjured up to try and justify said magic as best they could back in the day. We however are NOT back in the day and nobody should pretend otherwise or want it to be so. You are not going to have your mystical world and science (which is pointless without evolutionary theory) but that doesn’t seem to be a problem for you because you have already decided that they are just disdainful and blasphemous enterprises.  But I cannot even visualize a world without science let alone desire to live under those conditions … again.

PS - If you think that was an insult you had better never set foot in a bar; live with it because I don't care how you choose to interpret it. OK, if that is just so terrible I will, but when have you ever showed ANY compassion, concern or thoughtfulness concerning anything (everything) I say or believe but that is to be expected from YEC's. I don’t actually want to discuss geological stratification, and who in their right mind would (but I will if I have to) of free choice?

on Dec 05, 2012

Lulapilgrim, I can bring up just as many questionable things as you but won’t because it doesn’t work anymore and serves no purpose. This process has been compiled for us by people who have already had these tiresome age-old arguments for a few hundred years now, and more. I just don’t value your opinion of the sciences or of the natural world because I don’t think you have the educations or the inclination to make any constructive observations because you do not believe in reality or in humanity. The best you can do and all you have shown you are capable of is presenting arguments made by other YEC’s whose specific goal is nothing short of your own and for the exact same reasons … magic … imagine that. You can have your hand full of YEC’s who profess ‘honesty’ and I will gladly take my hand full of thousands of real scientists who think otherwise. I am not here to battle magic, who could because there are no rules, no way to contest it, no way to verify it, nobody ‘else’ can use it and no way to distinguish it from random chance without some actual participation by your idol which remains idle (hahaha, sorry) to this day, who I might add has been forthcoming for nigh unto 2,000 years now. God may be argued if you convince yourself that you need one. But you cannot make a case for a human named Jesus being made into some kind of a god because it is a contradiction of terms. I have been as patient as I know how to be but obviously you don’t take this as seriously as I do. I don’t have time to waste while you continuously look for another apologist to garner your ‘opinions’. I do not need to reference my material to speak my mind only to go into detail, something you don’t have. After a lifelong commitment and continuous memorization of the bible you should be smart enough to do the same, but you just cannot or you refuse to. To me it seems that you need to reassure yourself because this stuff doesn’t impress me and you know it. I don’t expect you to respond anymore because I don’t think you are up to the task and you can make no other argument than “god did it, somehow” and I am not buying that either. All you are interested in is evangelizing and I am not available or interested. If YOU have something to say that doesn’t come from someone else then it will be a novelty and appreciated. You could try your feelings for a change (it would be refreshing), but you do not seem to have much confidence in yourself or you would present your case differently for sure. I am sorry if this post closes our ‘discussion’ but I am tired of treading water for you. If you can prove ANYTHING then do so, or else call me when you can because I am tired of all this continuous and contemptuous nonsense and associated hocus pocus. Have a good life and I hope you find whatever you think you deserve. Oops, cannot close this post ... it was from a past persona, oh well.

on Dec 05, 2012

I wish you had the magic of paragraph breaks.

on Dec 05, 2012

Jythier
Reply #97 Jythier
Informative as usual I see. Don't like to use paragraphs with Lula because she makes a habit of quoting all the little paragraphs she thinks she has an answer for because there is a word or two flagged for incineration in it and the hell with the rest of paragraph. This way she at least has to find her own sections to comment on and hopefully cut down on all the silly quotes she plasters in her posts. Not interested in discussing much with you though until you do something about that religious chip on your shoulder and start treating women as the individuals they are … but then male Chauvinism is the theme in the bible too isn’t it, hummm. 

PS - bingo.

on Dec 05, 2012

GirlFriendTess
Quoting Jythier, reply 97Reply #97 JythierInformative as usual I see. Don't like to use paragraphs with Lula because she makes a habit of quoting all the little paragraphs she thinks she has an answer for because there is a word or two flagged for incineration in it and the hell with the rest of paragraph. This way she at least has to find her own sections to comment on and hopefully cut down on all the silly quotes she plasters in her posts. Not interested in discussing much with you though until you do something about that religious chip on your shoulder and start treating women as the individuals they are … but then male Chauvinism is the theme in the bible too isn’t it, hummm. 

 

You're a woman?

on Dec 05, 2012

 

GirlFriendTess
First of all the world exists and always has as far as mankind is concerned and that makes everything we find in it REAL.

Agree.

GirlFriendTess
I just don’t value your opinion of the sciences or of the natural world because I don’t think you have the educations or the inclination to make any constructive observations because you do not believe in reality or in humanity.

Of course I believe in reality and humanity. Where evolutionists go wrong is thinking and purporting Darwin Evolution is reality when in reality it hasn't gone beyond hypothesis/ theory.

And I have a very high opinion of Science. When one really thinks about it we are finding that Science, sound Science that is, supports the Special Creation premise  of explaining the reality of the world around us.   I'm talking about such things as the existence of coded information in cells and order in design and laws of nature. It is fair to say that modern Science of Genetics has brought to light insoluble problems for the possiblility of Darwin Evolution, change beyond kind.

Ape is one kind ....humans are a completely different kind. There never was evolution of apekind  to mankind. We now know from the science of Genetics that their respective DNA prevented such 'evolution'.

 

on Dec 05, 2012

GirlFriendTess
Don't like to use paragraphs with Lula because she makes a habit of quoting all the little paragraphs she thinks she has an answer for because there is a word or two flagged for incineration in it and the hell with the rest of paragraph.

So it's my fault???

 

 

on Dec 05, 2012

You wouldn't expect her to take any sort of personal responsibility, now, would you?  If it wasn't your fault, it would be her animal instincts kicking in that made her do it, or some other thing.

on Dec 05, 2012

lulapilgrim
Reply #100 lulapilgrim

It would be helpful if you stop with the generic terms like ‘evolutionists and atheists’ because they describe a wide range and variety of people from all walks of life and differing beliefs. The only reason you use them is because it allows you to attack everyone at once as if everyone else is conspiring against you and your beliefs. When have you ever shown respect for science of any kind? I asked you before to name the good sciences since you profess to know but you haven’t and you won’t because they are all intertwined too firmly, are tied into evolutionary theory and you cannot just snatch some out and expect the others to remain sound so please inform me? I don’t think you CAN argue about anything else besides the 19th century philosophy of one Charles Darwin no matter the subject. Darwin’s theory has been expanded, corrected, modified and updated as new information, technology and insights became available. To listen to you, well you make it sound like every time we wish to delve into EVOLUTIONARY THEORY, we pull out a copy of ‘On the Origin of Species, published in 1859 to get our bearings. It might help if you at least looked for the information available from this century don’t you think? Just because you like old outdated books doesn’t make it appealing to us. Apes are different than people but only a YEC would say they are completely different.

Changes in chromosomes during evolution: During human evolution, two ancestral ape chromosomes fused to produce human chromosome 2 (shown in the diagram, green outline). Humans are more distantly related to other mammals than to chimps. The greater divergence of chromosomal contiguity for cats and rats is shown. The major structural difference is that human chromosome 2 (green color code) was derived from two smaller chromosomes that are found in other great apes (now called 2A and 2B). Parts of human chromosome 2 are scattered among parts of several cat and rat chromosomes in these species that are more distantly related to humans (more ancient common ancestors; about 85 million years since the human/rodent common ancestor).

Human chromosome 2

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/19/Chimp_chromosomes.png

Maybe this is easier to see?

on Dec 05, 2012

lulapilgrim
Reply #101 lulapilgrim
Feeling sorry for yourself again? You are a piece of work for sure. I don't have any idea what this is even supposed to mean? I was talking to someone else and all I said was I don’t like your style of copying and pasting (the easy way IMO), what others have to say. If that makes ‘everything’ your fault then so be it, guess I don’t have to understand??? As I said, everything is just some kind of attack against you or the RCC (all in your mind along with your world) but I don’t have sympathy for self-induced paranoia. Jythier, maybe you can explain it to me then since you seem to know, yea right?

PS - Forget I asked Jythier, I forgot for sec who I was talking to!

on Dec 05, 2012

No we are nothing like the chimps, no way no how. So I guess these Bonobos must have learned the advantages of promiscuity from us then? Wonder who worked out the missionary position first … us or them?  Well they at least got the boss part right so they must have had a female god.

Lula, there are pornographic displays right from Nat Geo in this video so I wouldn’t watch it if I were you.

Wild Wives of Africa: Bonobo Love   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82GUjPConiE

What Separates Us from Chimps?   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzDLkPFjev4

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