At least bring common sense to the table
Opinion of a non believer
Published on November 5, 2011 By BoobzTwo In Religion

Actual History is chockfull of the rise and fall of religions for millennia … many Ages. And they all have the following in common. Whenever they became week enough to lose control of the majority of the sheeple, they are replaced with a new Messiah and a new message just as the Christians have done with the ‘old Jewish’ religion when that too lost its strangle hold on the world of Man due to its barbarism as perceived by man in a new Age. Anyone who lives in a future time views almost everything from previous times to be barbaric (except for those that thrive in barbarism) and in this Christianity is no exception. It is my belief that the purpose of religion has always been nothing but a methodology to control the masses. The Bible (OT and NT) are replete with plagiarisms from the actual real world of the past. The NT is in itself a plagiarism from much of the OT. The stories of the Bible are impossible in the real world in which we all exist. I agree that many names and places were real, but this is just another plagiarism from the actual history of man. If you can place your hand on a Bible and swear that the Earth is what ~12,000 years old, then you are a fool. If you deny the evidence of science and technology, then you are doubly a fool. If you deny the evidence of early man or prehistoric man and can find no logic or truth in evolution you are a damned fool. And if you are so foolish as to allow the leadership of some rascals who lived thousands of years ago during the ‘glorious’ days when all this stuff was concocted … to control virtually every aspect of your life today, you are doomed. But all you have to do is ‘have faith’ and ignore your own perceptions of reality … and all will be yours, just bring your pocket book and come often … because we have castles and churches and armies to build to prove they are right, yea right. The all-powerful all-knowing one God would never vanquish the devil (certainly within reason for the all-powerful mindful of His sheep) because He would be destroying Himself … as there can be no light without the dark? What better ploy could man devise than to make the light and the dark impervious to the perceptions of man, the sheeple? The complete history of the universe and that insignificant little planet Earth with its complete compliment of well ‘everything’ … all described between the covers of a book written thousands of years ago by smart (-ass) people with nothing benign in mind whatsoever who championed a flat Earth for a thousand years for naught than to promote the new religion of the Age of Pisces … the two fish. It took man and a simple invention called a telescope to start the downward spiral of Religion (Christianity this time) and it cannot be stopped.


Comments (Page 8)
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on Dec 05, 2012

 

GirlFriendTess
If you are going to discuss the timeframe of genesis, then I would have to discuss some of the Cultures that existed on the real earth when your ‘first two’ humans were being poofed from dirt. Like the Badari culture on the Nile (c. 4400–4000 BC), Comb Ceramic culture (also endured the 6th, 4th), Maykop culture, Yangshao culture, Merimde culture on the Nile (c. 4570–4250 BC), Predynastic Egypt, and Proto-Austronesian culture is based on the south coast of China. They combine extensive maritime technology, fishing hooks, nets and gardening. (c. 5000 BC), Samara culture, Sredny Stog culture, Lengyel culture in eastern Europe, Ubaid culture, Cycladic culture—a distinctive Neolithic culture amalgamating Anatolian and mainland Greek elements arose in the western Aegean before 4000 BC, VinĨa culture (also endured the 6th, 4th, and 3rd millennia) and Yumuktepe and Gözlükule cultures in south Anatolia. But we aren’t going to go there are we? How am I supposed to even discuss genesis with you???

lulapilgrim
You are discussing Genesis with me. Every one of these cultures came from the descendents of the sons of Noe.

GirlFriendTess
....Don't be so silly. Since you won’t tell me then I will ASSUME you believe the world to be <6,000 years old and that makes the creation of your first two people in the 4th century bc. As I stated, these cultures existed before your creation myth Day 1 so pardon me if I don't think you are being anything but insincere when your answer is "Every one of these cultures came from the descendants of the sons of Noe" . I tried to tell you the two are not compatible because your whole mystical world is just the blink of an eye in mine, geologically.

 Actually, I do believe the world is about 6,000 years old. If one mixes the Biblical texts with secular sources, a chronology can be developed which of course many scholars have done. I already mentioned in #85 what the Chruch Fathers calculated. Genesis 5 gives the chronology from Adam to the birth of Noe's sons. Genesis 7:6 gives the age of Noe when the flood waters came. Totaling these, the Hebrew Masoretic texts give 1656 years from Creation, and the Greek Septuagint gives 2262 years. Genesis 11 gives the genealogy from Shem to Abram and from that we can calculate the number of years from the Flood to the birth of Abram.   Using good ol' Science by way of archaeological evidence, scholars agree Abram lived about 2,000 BC.

In the 1600s, an Anglican archbishop, James Ussher, wrote a 1,300 page opus on the history of the world. He calculated Creation took place in 4004 BC. He wasn't the only one...two famous scientists Kepler calculated the date of Creation as 3992 BC and Isaac Newton calculated 4000 BC. Evidently, we still have the detailed calculations.

After that, we have the Jewish chronologies compliled in the 2nd century. The year 2000 AD was 5760 years according to the Jewish Seder Olam. This places Creation in the year 3760 BC which is a bit younger. So 6,000 years old in the rough ball park.

 That makes your math correct in your  comment, "that makes the creation of your first two people in the 4th century.."

According to Ussher's calculations, Adam was created in 4004 BC and Noe was born in 2948 BC. Abraham was about 2,000 BC.  

I said earlier that these cultures you cited  came from the descendants of the sons of Noe. Also that the famous Jewish historian Josephus confirmed that 150 years after the Flood, Cham's (Ham) generations built cities (Babylon where the Tower of Babel is built, Nineva, Assyria, etc.) and using the natural resources established civilizations...then Sumer, now Iraq.

Again, using the good ol' science of archaeology which according to Miriam Webster is defined as "the scientific study o fmaterial remains (as fossil relics, artifacts, and monuments) of past human life and activities."  

Archaeologists can date artifacts back to 1000 BC with reasonable accuracy, and back to 2500 BC within a hundred years. But beyond that their dating methods are subject to errors. No credible archaeological dating of an ancient civilization antedates 3000 BC.

So theses cultures that you list above are cultures all right...but the age...no solid proof of age. The oldest archaeological find is believed to be Old Sumer which is at the southeastern corner of the Fertile Crescent. From the written records from ancient inhabitants of Mesopatamia, Egypt and other Near Eastern areas, many scholars believe that Nimrod founded Old Sumer (which is in accordance with the biblical record and chronology as well).

Another point I'll make at this time, is that I believe dinosaurs (then called dragons) were contemporaries of ante and post diluvian man. And I say that for good reason....fossilized dinosaur and human footprints were found together in the bed of the Paluxy River near Glen Rose,Texas as well as based on the literature of the earliest civilizations with pictures of dinosaurs found carved in caves and canyons. Also, the fact that scientists found soft blood cells in a dinosaur which indicates they are thousands of years old and not millions helps my case as well.  

I know you object to all this believing that science has invalidated Biblical chronology and the history that goes along with it.

But a real critical examination of the science that you rely on especially of the fossil record and the dating methods should change your mind....but I won't hold my breath!!!

 

 

 

 

 

  

 

on Dec 05, 2012

 

 

GirlFriendTess
It would be helpful if you stop with the generic terms like ‘evolutionists and atheists’ because they describe a wide range and variety of people from all walks of life and differing beliefs.

I use the term Evolutionists to describe those people who believe Darwin's Evolution theory as fact.    

GirlFriendTess
.... First of all the world exists and always has as far as mankind is concerned and that makes everything we find in it REAL. We have real science that deals with real evidence because we are not privy to magic so it never enters the equations. Simply, science only deals with reality for the sole purpose of becoming more knowledgeable about ‘nature’.

Totally agree. Real science....real evidence is NOT Darwin's Evolution however. You said earlier that if I could prove anything then to do so....well, how many times do I have to tell you that the Real science of Genetics with real evidence has thoroughly disproven Darwin Evolution. (and note in coming up with the proof, I haven't used what you demean as my "mystical world" and "magic".)  

 

GirlFriendTess
You are not going to have your mystical world and science (which is pointless without evolutionary theory) but that doesn’t seem to be a problem for you because you have already decided that they are just disdainful and blasphemous enterprises. But I cannot even visualize a world without science let alone desire to live under those conditions … again.

Here you go...saying ....science is pointless without evolutionary theory...when it is no such thing. It would be IF Darwin Evolution was a true fact, but it is not.  It's a hypothesis that has never, ever had any real evidence which showed man developed step by step from lower ape kinds. There is nothing that genetically connects man to apes or monkeys. Almighty God created man substantially in the same form as he is today. He created apes in the same form they are today.  Each is uniquely special with its own coded DNA and DNA is the barrier that proves that not any one of the major kinds arose from a different kind. DNA disallows evolution, change beyond kind to occur.

GirlFriendTess
Darwin’s theory has been expanded, corrected, modified and updated as new information, technology and insights became available.

I know. they keep trying to find the missing mechanism that change beyond kind occurs and it just isn't there..so they change and tweak, change and tweak, and hope the elusive mechanism will be found.

 

GirlFriendTess
It might help if you at least looked for the information available from this century don’t you think?

I have...Genetics... is that modern enough for you...it is for me.

 

GirlFriendTess
Apes are different than people but only a YEC would say they are completely different.

 

And even though the modern sciences have proven otherwise, only true blue evolutionists continue to believe Darwin Evolution is fact and we humankind evolved from them.

 

GirlFriendTess
Changes in chromosomes during evolution: During human evolution, two ancestral ape chromosomes fused to produce human chromosome

No, no, no. Not true. This is an evolutionists fantasy dream that has been proven untrue.

Here's why. Thanks to Molecular biology we know it goes to the sheer complexity in the design of cells. each living organism have in their genes an information storage and retrieval system which is likened to an alphabetical code and they are arranged in sequences which take on specific meaning. They contain information for a specific protein synthesis. What you suggest that two ape chromosomes fused to produce human chromosome couldn't ever possibly happen because even though the genetics instructions are similar the order in which the information is expressed makes all the difference.

So again God's special design of our DNA separates us from apes and makes us so very different.

It's getting late, but next I'll connect the tenets of Secular Humanism (a religion) and show how Humanism and Evolution are both parts of a vicious circle. 

 

 

 

on Dec 06, 2012

lulapilgrim
Reply #106 lulapilgrim
Ok that's nice but it doesn't mean much besides your personal belief that NO method of dating is accurate, only guesswork, geese. Seems that counting tree rings is just too guessy for you YEC’s too huh. I know … because those wascally scientists sure do know how to spin yarns and just so they can fool all the educated people because the uneducated naturally know better. I will hazard that you never studied chemistry, biology, physics or nuclear physics and that you know little of the periodic table of the elements or even what it is used for. Bet calculus is an unknown for you as well as atomic theory, thermodynamics, heat transfer and fluid flow, electronics, electricity etc. And of course you don’t have any use for those silly scientific theories or the years of intense study required to formulate them; just a bunch of guesses and deceits designed to destroy Christianity of all things. What a sad view you have of humanity and their masterful accomplishments but you sure do have an ecstatic adulation towards anyone in a penguin suit with the ever present collection plate in hand. I gave the dates and you can reject them as you feel you must, I don’t care. Wouldn’t have expected anything else, honestly ... but your bad opinion of things scientific changes nothing in the real world. I controlled nuclear reactions for 20 years including startups and shutdowns and I KNOW the math is right because I made the calculations myself. If my calculations proved to be off by +/- .1% at criticality, the reactors were scrammed and new calculations made. They are harder to make a second time because of oscillating flux patterns in the core complicate the process. We HAVE to know exactly what is decaying into what else etc. and the half-lives of the elements of concern must be very precise to even allow a new calculation. So pardon me if I question your intellectual honesty and your scientific credibility because you don’t seem to offer much of either. They ‘made us’ make our calculations back in the day with a slide rule because they didn’t trust the new calculators that were becoming available. Bureaucracy geese, of course we used our handy new TI’s, we just had to be careful to round the numbers ‘properly’ as if done with a rule. You don’t ever say biology, chemistry or even genetics is bad or any other science by name; you just group them all into one of your Christian circles (the Darwinian evolution circle) so you can talk about how bad ‘science’ is. And stop with the nonsense that Darwinian evolution is science because you have no clue. [It is mostly true but you are not allowed to know why or else you will despise ALL science, oh my …]

lulapilgrim
But a real critical examination of the science that you rely on especially of the fossil record and the dating methods should change your mind....but I won't hold my breath!!!
Don't, because you don’t have any inkling of how many different techniques we have at our disposal to tell time because you have your favorite one to pick on. Carbon dating is reasonably accurate to ~50,000 years or so but acceptable results can be reached back to ~100,000 years with the use of the newer accelerator techniques for carbon dating. This is all pretty mundane and basic stuff Lula and it is not questionable, at least not by a 6,000 year old creation myth.

on Dec 06, 2012

GirlFriendTess
Reply #107 lulapilgrim
Have you EVER written a letter to someone? Do you copy and paste everything from your last communication just to make things clear? Just wondering because it doesn’t help me one bit (you are talking to me right?) and just because you are in a life struggle to maintain your fantasy doesn’t equate to me being in this war of your choosing. I have made my biblical search and came up wanting. It cannot be any kind of godly rendition unless god was truly a cruel and deceitful barbarian. The only point to this whole discussion is that you HAVE to make genesis work. Believe what you like but I will take offense when you try to rain on my parade when your justification is that you have to make genesis work. This ‘evolutionist fantasy dream’ was instrumental in denouncing ID (as was creationism denounced), so good luck with that nonsense. How does one live in a dream world, why would anyone besides a drug addict want to? You disavow your own eyes, you disbelieve all science, you disbelieve in a useful education, and you think magic should be taught in public school. You think everyone in the world must be made to believe what you do without any options worth considering and you think the entire world is plotting as one to destroy Christianity. Anything whatsoever that you cannot reconcile with your book is a blatant attack on the RCC and on and on and on. Truth is I don’t value your uninformed and uneducated opinions because they are mathematically untenable, physically impossible and right up there with ‘ancient aliens’.  You were born in the twentieth century, what communications have you had with god such that you know his will; just wondering because you often tell me he has? If you do not know the difference between an opinion and an attack, then you deserve to worry endlessly over everything because that seems to be what you like. I for one would actually like to discuss something in more detail. Your dropping of a comment, assuming it is true for both of us and moving on to the next attack (where you use this) and assert you proved your assumed case previously, this is unacceptable, what bollox. Don’t care what you think of ‘secular humanism’ because you cannot even justify christianity but you still want to tell the world what’s what.

Ken Miller on Human Evolution   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zi8FfMBYCkk

on Dec 06, 2012

This is a good example of why I have a difficult time just trying to understand you and why I think you are deceived by your church and company.

Ken Miller talks about how to respond to pseudo-science   http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=K2OAYRqBa7I&feature=endscreen

Geese I hated chemistry more than any course, whew.

on Dec 06, 2012

 

 

lulapilgrim
I know you object to all this believing that science has invalidated Biblical chronology and the history that goes along with it.

But a real critical examination of the science that you rely on especially of the fossil record and the dating methods should change your mind....but I won't hold my breath!!!

GirlFriendTess
Carbon dating is reasonably accurate to ~50,000 years or so but acceptable results can be reached back to ~100,000 years with the use of the newer accelerator techniques for carbon dating. This is all pretty mundane and basic stuff Lula and it is not questionable, at least not by a 6,000 year old creation myth.

The most accurate thing we can say of Carbon dating is that it is only reliable up to a few thousand years. No way carbon dating is reasonably accurate to 50,000 back to 100,000 years, although evolutionists have elected to date archaeological finds as such.

In his book,"Radiocarbon ages in Error", an anthropologist, Robert Lee, wrote the following:

"The troubles of the radiocarbon dating method are undeniably deep and serious. Despite 35 years of technical refinement and better understanding, the  underlying assumptions have been strongly challenged and warnings are out that radiocarbon may soon find itself in a crisis situation. Continuing use of the method depends on a "fix-it-as-we-go" approach , allowing for contamination here, fractionation there, and calibration whenever possible. It should be no surprise, then, that fully half of the dates are rejected. The wonder is, surely, that the remaining half come to be accepted.

No matter how "useful" it is, though, the radiocarbon method is still not capable of yielding accurate and reliable results. There are gross discrepancies, the chronology is uneven and relative, and the accepted dates are actually elected dates."

I think Mr. Lee knows something about carbon dating and surely the evolutionists know this as well. And now so do you.

GirlFriendTess
Seems that counting tree rings is just too guessy for you YEC’s too huh. I know … because those wascally scientists sure do know how to spin yarns and just so they can fool all the educated people because the uneducated naturally know better.

I know the science of Dendrochronology or tree ring dating is used in archaeology and to provide calibration in radiometric and carbon dating. The oldest known living thing is the bristlecone pine. Some living specimens have yielded the ages from 4600 to 4900 years old. That means they would have sprouted shortly after the Great Flood of Noe.  And we have historical information that we can compare with that so it's quite accurate.

I note that you have posted a video of Ken Miller, but we have discussed his ideas enough already.

But by now, at least in this discussion, I have had enough of refuting your evolutionists talking points, their charts, videos and icons of Evolution.

Your blog is about Religion and since the courts have declared Secular Humanism a religion (one by this discussion in which you seem to practice in full). And since this discussion has led to Evolution, which is no surprise because one cannot exist without the other, I will change my focus to that.

The common elements or tenets of Secular Humanism (SH) are set forth in the Humanist Manifesto I and II and in the Secular Humanist Declaration.

The first tenet of SH denies the relevance of God and therefore does not accept Sacred Tradition or the Bible as the Divinely inspired word of God. Instead of worship and prayer, the Secular Humanist finds his religion expressed in a heightened sense of personal life.

The 2nd tenet of SH is the belief that man can begin with himself and answer the questions which confront mankind.

The 3rd tenet of SH is the belief in the inevitability of progress which is perpetuated through Evolutionary theory and its cultural application (Social Darwinism). 

The 4th tenet of SH is the belief in Science as the guide to human progress and the ultimate provider of an alternative to both Religion and morals. (Here Science itself assumes a religious character).

the 5th tenet of SH is in the belief in the self-sufficiency of man which encompasses the assertion of the independence of man apart from Almighty God thereby supposedly releasing him from all obligations to Him.

The 6th tenet of SH is the belief in the absolute of Evolution and that's why I said earlier that one cannot exist without the other.

Evolution was/is nurtured in the Humanistic philosophy which teaches that man is sufficient in himself and does not need God. Those people do not believe in Evolution because it is an established scientific fact (which it is not), but they believe in Evolution because they wish to escape the authority of God.

With the modern sciences of Genetics, Molecular biology, etc., we now know with all certainty that Darwin Evolution hasn't ever occurred, is not occurring and will not ever occur. It is genetically impossible for change beyond kind. Yet, virtually all this evidence is suppressed and kept from our children and the public. Instead of being honest, evolutionists perpetuate the lie.

  

 

 

   

 

 

on Dec 06, 2012

lulapilgrim
Reply #111 lulapilgrim
Well I have tried to be patient but I am about done with your nonsense having never known a person with such a closed mind. You believe in a 6,000 year old universe and everything that entails from a 1st century perspective and you do not believe anything else period. You profess not to believe in evolution or science yet you spend all your time arguing these subjects none of which have anything to do with the bible. If that is not a closed mind as in slammed shut then I don’t know what is. Problem here is you started this mess with all the knowledge you can have … we started out with nothing and have been building our case ever since and now we know better and can prove our case for an aged universe. Now it is your turn to tread the waters of ignorance. Prove the world to be young or quit pissing into the wind ... prove ONE miracle or quit shoving your magic in my face. Show me your research explaining the exhaustive testing and retesting methods you guys used and the peer reviewed papers you folks have submitted repeatedly. How much worldwide support from your other experts can you muster to your banner, 1, 2 or maybe 3? Why do you suppose your scientifically inclined YEC’s bypass the scientific process and jump to the courts for relief? I will tell you, it is because they are not stupid that is why they didn’t even try to defend their case; they just expect you to be. Well the hell with your catholic sensibilities, your bigotry and hypocrisy, your infallible beliefs, your absolute truths and your self-imposed authority over everything and everyone. You are nothing but a human being just like I am. You have no godly attributes at all that you can tout such as a better memory or a direct channel to god. You don’t know anything I don’t (nothing personal), you have no private catholic channel to the Pope (the high priest of pulling the wool over everyone’s eyes) and your god never ever told you anything that it didn’t tell me. Neither of us has ever spoken to an angel, a fairy, a gnome, a talking snake (animal), a cherub, a devil, a witch or any other biblical messenger, not even a talking bush. I fail to see how any of this makes you more knowledgeable or more learned than anyone else … but rather the opposite because you have convinced yourself you know everything important. Not only are you not looking for any answers but are determined to impede everyone else from looking too, good luck there. Well I do not lie, steal or cheat and do the best I can for my fellow man. I do not try to force anything on anyone unless violence is warranted as in criminal activity. I am not responsible for anything evolutionary and I DGS if you choose to believe something different. I have data on everything … everything … and you have your archaic little black book. All I have told you is that I think said book is not the word of any god, just those of illiterate ‘cavemen’ and therefore it is not a source of truth. If you want to use it well that is your problem not mine. I cannot make the bible work and obviously you cannot either or you would be about showing people how it works. But since you cannot, you spend all your time reading YEC apologists, borrowing their arguments so you can pretend to be knowledgeable and trying to break the real world so you can stuff it into your imaginary one. You and people like you are doing everything possible to destroy science, medicine, education, ambition, motivation, incentive, freedom and tolerance. Until such time as you can treat me as an actual human being don’t bother me anymore. I am tired of you telling me that everything I value in life, everything I busted my ass for like an education and everything I know is wrong … not because you can prove anything at all in your favor or against my worldview … just so you can bask in your 6,000 year old magic ridden barbaric worldview. Lula I don't need any tenets, why should I when I have an encyclopedia and an education and I know how to use both. You are so foolish it is beyond natural. This is the age of the internet and I can find books on just about anything I want. This is one of the reasons why I do not forgive your willful ignorance of the facts. I have repeatedly told you to stop classifying me as if I belong to some movement or another. But even worse than classifying me, you then have the unadulterated gall to tell me what I believe, why I believe it, what I have to read and abide by and then why it is all wrong. All the while you ignore everything I tell you about myself or my beliefs because you are a catholic and you just know better. You can take your humanist secularist socialist atheist evolutionist freethinker terminology and all your church definitions and shove them where the sun doesn’t shine.

on Dec 07, 2012

‘Biblical morals’ is an archaic oxymoron because none but the most radical of people follow ALL the wisdoms of god, most decide all on their own what parts are good and what parts are bad and that is proof that we all have a conscience and do in fact make our own moral decisions with or without the bible. Westboro Baptist Church is an example of a cult that much more strictly adheres to biblical teachings more than catholics and most other christians, and they are despicable in everyone’s eyes. If you want to live a 1st century lifestyle, all you have to do is move to Iran and you could participate in the senseless hate crimes and religious murders too, all in the name of god of course.

Your moral guide   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IC-9uJrotC4&feature=g-high-u

on Dec 08, 2012

Lula I am an atheist and as such I am not going to discuss your religious dogma any more, it is pointless. I do not believe in any god and that makes the bible(s) useless documents to me, surely you understand this? What you believe is what you believe and as hard as it is for you to understand what I believe is what I believe and I believe it just as fervently as you. All you are interested in is Darwinian evolution because for some reason (because you do NOT understand science) you think that proving ANYTING in error no matter the degree is going to actually debunk evolution, it isn’t going to happen. I don’t expect you to answer so I am going to spend some time giving you a piece or two of my mind without any of your magical interference. As a YEC, you are forced by your choice to view the bible literally and your personal opinions are not wanted. I don’t know where you went to school, but if you have a HS diploma, then you have NO excuse for being as ignorant of science as you imply. I have repeatedly tried to get you to just talk to me, but due to your obsession with magic you do not seem to be able to, what a pity. Instead you choose to take everything presented to you as some kind of personal attack. You do not even want to talk about anything preferring to drop an opinion, claim it is not refutable and must be true and then off you go and all this from the conclusion of one, yourself. I have never known a more conceited person in my life. You though are a special case because you have a commercial church that has authorized itself to represent god … think about that if you can anymore. If god was so keen on inspiring a book filled with all the wonders and magic we need to live a full and fulfilling life by, then why did he oversee the destruction of the originals and their copies and their copies considering your belief that god kept the information chain true? Seems he didn’t have any more use for actual proof than you do, imagine that. As a matter of fact, I am quite sure that your god will surprisingly have exactly the same likes, dislikes, hates and loves that you do, it just goes with each religion and is always unquestionable, how could it be otherwise. I am sick of your ostentatious attitude, your disrespect for humanity in any capacity and your conclusion that we are good for nothing besides unquestionably capitulating to magic … and your disrespect for god whom you feel empowered to speak for … unseen, unheard and unquestionably imperceptible except to you catholics. You and your RCC are an abomination in all respects, to man and the god you profess as well as to common sense and reason. If there were a devil, I could not think of a better accomplishment than to convince man that he could understand and speak for god.

on Dec 08, 2012

In the Stone Age, the ancient Jews planted the concept of a flat earth (in spite of Greece) so well in god’s mind that he inspired the Christians with the same idea too. Thinking about the Muslims (???), I thought well why not let’s take a peek. I don’t care for Islam at all for many obvious reasons so I never looked. Hundreds of years after the Christians took up the flat banner, god told Mohammad the same story it learned from the wise old Stone Age Jews. So here we have the three Abrahamic religions whose founding(s) exceed a thousand year span … and god got it wrong each time. Ever since we forced the telescope past the church gauntlet, we knew better … again. And now in this modern age all three of these religions are doing their best to make it sound anything but flat and are equally lacking in merit. Was god incapable of communicating the reality he made to the very people he inspired to know the absolute truth? If god is faultless, then it had to have been made wrong by the biblical authors … because it is wrong.

The Quran - Muhammad's flat Earth   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_FaNg_nxqns

on Dec 09, 2012

Hi GFTess,

You profess not to believe in evolution or science

Here you go again! When have I ever professed not to believe in Science? Yes, of course I believe in Science and I'm thankful for the many dedicated scientists all around the world. Science is knowledge based on observed facts and tested truths  arranged in an orderly system. Science according to my dictionary is verified knowledge. That's true Science.

Yes, I have made crystal clear that I don't believe Stellar and Darwin Evolution. Neither one is Science as Science is described above. Neither one is founded on scientific facts.

we started out with nothing and have been building our case ever since and now we know better and can prove our case for an aged universe.

This has been asserted and claimed as fact so often that it's become obvious it's an evolutionist gospel being preached.  The universe is 10-20 billions years old is a presumption, not an observed fact.

Evolutionists claim the earth is 4.5 billion years old.

Yet, There are a number of actual facts of Science that give limits for the age of the earth.

One of them is the amount of radiogenic Helium in the atmosphere. It's far too little for the evolutionary belief the earth is 4.5 billions of years old. there was also a high retention of Helium which provides double proof for a young earth for if the earth were millions of years old, that helium would have totally escaped.

Analysis of zircon crystals from deep in the earth revealed that almost no increase of lead escaped. This is powerful evidence of a young earth, consistent with a 6-10,000 year age.  

The population of the earth suggests the earth is "young". Evolutionists think humankind has been here for 1 or 2 million years. Even including wars, diseases and deaths, and only 2 children, the population would be 10 to the 2070 power in one million years.

The salt and mineral content of the oceans suggest the Earth is "young".

The earth's magnetic field suggests the Earth is "young".

I've already mentioned trillions of  polonium halos found in rock formations, granite, all over this planet. Robert Gentry has written a book and reported his findings in professional journals, but unfortunately, he's been shut out of the evolutionists science community because they realize his discoveries support a young earth and very strong evidence for Special Creation.

 

prove ONE miracle

Fatima, Portugal, October 13, 1917. The miracle of the Sun. The Blessed Virgin Mary appeared to 3 small children, Jacinta (age 7) and Francisco Marto (9) and Lucia dos Santos (10) and promised to deliver them a miracle. She did..The Miracle of the Sun. Google it. It happened in front of thousands of eye witnesses in the Cova da Iria and in neighboring villages and a detailed account was reported in several newspapers, O Dia and O Seculo in Lisbon and the Ordem.

on Dec 09, 2012

lulapilgrim
Yes, I have made crystal clear that I don't believe Stellar and Darwin Evolution [better served if you state what you believe not disbelieve, I am not clueless]. Neither one is Science as Science is described above [most certainly are]. Neither one is founded on scientific facts [ditto].
This from one who believes the bible is packed full of facts, proof and nothing but the truth geese. If the sciences aren’t founded in science, then what are they founded in ... magic??? Not believing in something has no more weight than believing that something without some practical proof for such claims. Anything can be done magically; too bad you cannot prove any of it. When I try to discuss genesis you just opt out with god did it … end of story. And whenever I try to discuss evolutionary theory, you opt out with it just doesn’t work … again end of story. But the only thing you seem inclined to actually discuss is your dogma and nothing else. And of course I don’t really want to discuss anything so rooted in magic because I cannot discuss it logically or reasonably because it isn’t. I have tried to explain this to you but you pretend not to understand. Let’s try this then: take evolutionary theory out of the equation and ALL science crumbles which is the same as saying none of them work. You of course will pretend this false but you simply are not willing to give man any accolades at all. You don’t say biology, chemistry or genetics are bad or don’t work, just the evolutionary parts but there is no way to separate the two. You make it sound like we have two sets of books, one we use for real science (as defined by a YEC???) and the other we pull out whenever we want to crush the bible … BS. To be fair, now remove genesis from the bible and then try to make the rest of it work. Nothing works when you remove necessary parts for either of us. Well you would never remove genesis and I will continue to believe evolution until such time as the evidence points elsewhere. Will you at least agree that you cannot make science work because you are not scientifically competent and let’s be honest here; you don’t want it to work. Whenever I want a scientific explanation, why would I go to a YEC to seek the answers especially considering the above and how I feel about YEC’s? Why don’t you ever reference a competent scientists or are they all just bad if they aren’t YEC’s or is this what it takes to be a ‘good scientist IYO?

NAME the bad sciences or tell me how you separate the ‘bad parts’? The problem here Lula is that you are trying to beak something you already don’t believe in and never have. But genesis is god’s flawless and unquestionable error free truths … give it a break. As long as you persist that the earth is young we cannot even discuss evolution because there is no time for it. You cannot go through someone else’s prepared excuses (assuming they actually have credentials?) and just list them as YOUR arguments. If you want to DISCUSS the He in the atmosphere, the age of the earth, zircon crystals, populations, salt or magnetic fields that is fine, but you cannot just drop these appeasements and pretend they are meaningful without support. Why that would be the same as quoting a bible passage and just proclaiming it to be true and unquestionable, which you do all the time. Whenever I ask for proof you always quote other biblical passages as your proof … and you cannot see anything wrong with this circular logic?

on Dec 09, 2012

lulapilgrim
Fatima, Portugal, October 13, 1917. The miracle of the Sun.
Miracle - (Noun), an effect or extraordinary event in the physical world that surpasses all known human or natural powers and is ascribed to a supernatural cause. Probably everything in the 1st century was ascribed as a miracle but we live in the 21st century and what used to appear miraculous then does no more because we have exponentially increased our knowledge while you have stagnated for a couple thousand years professing to have known everything important on day 1. There are no miracles because they require magic and there is no such thing as ‘real magic’, that is a contradiction of terms and it has never been proven. I don’t know what happened in 1917, but if it happened today as it has been ‘observed’ many times since then, it would have a better scientific explanation, one you wouldn’t believe I am sure. If god were interested in making a statement, seems he would miracle a bunch of scientists and skeptics … instead of a few children and the gullible masses who already believe such things ... or is that how it works. Had everyone saw the same thing it would be more persuasive but they didn’t. You know as well as I do the potential damage from looking into a nuclear explosion even at 93 million miles but they didn’t seem to mind. Maybe the ‘miracle’ was that they didn’t go blind or suffer permanent eye damage. I am afraid that if the creator of everything is only capable of communicating with children and some followers by fanning the sun (which is not earth), then his communication skill haven’t improved one bit since whenever.

I didn’t list the genetic codes above as anything but a starting point not the whole story. You were supposed to pretend you know the science and argue against the genetic codes … but as always you just proclaim it untrue and then you move on with the predisposition that you proved something??? If you want to discuss any of this stuff then let’s do it and stop with your blanket rejection of anything scientific. If you actually knew science and understood it and the proper terminology (don’t have to believe it), you wouldn’t (couldn’t) say the things you do about it. Unlike you I spent several years trying to make the bible work … not to break it or to prove it doesn’t work. I did everything I could think of to prove the bible true and couldn’t (just as Bart Ehrman). Have you ever made any attempt to actually try and make evolution work, I think not … you just don’t want it to work and that is good enough for you. Unlike you I do not pick and choose what science I want to believe and trash the parts I don’t find useful … and the same for the bible, it works as advertised as infallible truth or it doesn’t. It doesn’t work in any real sense because it only offers magic as an explanation for everything real (???) that we have been discussing, and I use the term discussion loosely. Does the real world have any experts IYO on anything? Have you ever worked on a jigsaw puzzle and then found out that many pieces were missing in the end? You don’t have any problem looking at what you do have and logically (mentally) supply the information necessary for a better picture and it works the same for evolution too. You don’t measure the picture by the missing pieces, you measure it by the pieces you have and you fill in the blanks to get ~ the whole jigsaw. We have enough of the evolutionary puzzle pieces to know for a fact that ALL things weren’t poofed into existence and that is all we would need to prove the biblical god and genesis wrong if that were our purpose but it isn’t. You seem to think we need to prove everything wrong before any of it is considered wrong which of course we have no interest in at all. It has nothing to do with science your bible, and science doesn’t have anything to do with anything unreal or magical. It is that simple.

on Dec 10, 2012

 

 

lulapilgrim
Fatima, Portugal, October 13, 1917. The miracle of the Sun. The Blessed Virgin Mary appeared to 3 small children, Jacinta (age 7) and Francisco Marto (9) and Lucia dos Santos (10) and promised to deliver them a miracle. She did..The Miracle of the Sun. Google it. It happened in front of thousands of eye witnesses in the Cova da Iria and in neighboring villages and a detailed account was reported in several newspapers, O Dia and O Seculo in Lisbon and the Ordem.

GirlFriendTess
Miracle - (Noun), an effect or extraordinary event in the physical world that surpasses all known human or natural powers and is ascribed to a supernatural cause.

Yes, what happened on Oct. 13, 1917 in Fatima Portugal is definitely a miracle.

GirlFriendTess
Probably everything in the 1st century was ascribed as a miracle but we live in the 21st century and what used to appear miraculous then does no more because we have exponentially increased our knowledge while you have stagnated for a couple thousand years professing to have known everything important on day 1.

The Miracle of the Sun happened in the 20th century and many of the thousands who saw it were naysayers and skeptics, like you.

GirlFriendTess
I don’t know what happened in 1917,

Well, check it out sometime and without prejudice and a fair and open mind.

GirlFriendTess
There are no miracles

Ha,ha, ha.  It is a documented, historical fact the Miracle of the Sun happened.

And miracles are still occurring today. The miracles at Lourdes, France should provide sufficient evidence.  

  

 

  

on Dec 10, 2012

GirlFriendTess
I didn’t list the genetic codes above as anything but a starting point not the whole story. You were supposed to pretend you know the science and argue against the genetic codes …

I did argue against the evolutionist dogmatic claim that 2 ancestral ape chromosomes fused to produce human chromosome 2.

It never happened and can't happen and I explained why it is impossible for ape chromosomes to fuse to produce human chromosome 2 in my 107 reply.  

Here it is again.

No, no, no. Not true. This is an evolutionist fantasy dream that has been proven untrue.

Here's why. Thanks to Molecular biology we know it goes to the sheer complexity in the design of cells. each living organism have in their genes an information storage and retrieval system which is likened to an alphabetical code and they are arranged in sequences which take on specific meaning. They contain information for a specific protein synthesis. What you suggest that two ape chromosomes fused to produce human chromosome couldn't ever possibly happen because even though the genetics instructions are similar,  the order in which the information is expressed makes all the difference.

So again God's special design of our DNA separates us from apes and makes us so very different.

Simply re-asserted...Advanced studies in molecular biology prove the evolutionist claim that 2 ancestral ape chromosomes fused to produce human chromosome 2 didn't every occur and indeed, is  impossible to occur. 

GirlFriendTess
If you want to discuss any of this stuff then let’s do it and stop with your blanket rejection of anything scientific. If you actually knew science and understood it and the proper terminology (don’t have to believe it), you wouldn’t (couldn’t) say the things you do about it.

You need to start following your own admonishments for it seems it's you who has rejected the findings of advanced molecular biology that have scientifically, empirically disproven the evolutionist claim of apes chromosomes fusing to produce human chromosome.

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